Saturn's Favorite Music Podcast

Justin: Back then it would've been, yeah, crank it up. Let me break some things. But now, like I said, can appreciate you just have to Laura: Replace the things that you broke and... Justin: Yeah, exactly. At a certain age it's like, I think I hurt myself breaking things and not as entertaining. You got to think about it and weigh out. Do I want to break that badly enough that I might get injured? There still might be a yes on occasion. Laura: Welcome to the Saturn's favorite music podcast. I'm Laura Lee and I wrote a book called Saturn's Favorite Music, which is set in a radio station in 1992 to 1993. And this podcast goes through the music that you would've heard at that time if you worked in a radio station, what you would've heard on the air, and in this case, what you would've heard off the air the DJs like to listen to. And I have a couple of guests today, Jane Taylor and Justin Miller. Thanks for being here. Justin: You're welcome. Thanks for having us. Good to see you. Laura: Yeah, Jane and I met when we worked at a store called Brighter Days, just kind of a hippie shop, not a head shop. We didn't have paraphernalia, but we had hippie dresses and hair dye and stuff like that. Jane: Yep. Yeah, we struck up quite a friendship. That was a cool time. Laura: So is that hippie kind of stuff, your kind of musical groundwater, or what do you listen to when you're not being assigned stuff? Justin: Specifically her or me? Because there is carryover, but we actually do have relatively different eclectic tastes. Yes. Laura: I guess each of you, what kind of stuff would you normally be listening to? Justin: Okay, ladies, first. Jane: So I grew up on John Denver and Jackson Brown and Peter Paul and Mary and all that kind of stuff. Laura: Singer, songwriter, folky sixties stuff. Jane: Yeah, yeah. Very folky. Of course, in middle school I was into all the pop stuff, whatever was top 40. By the mid to eighties going into the nineties, I got more into listening to radio Woodstock and really expanding out more what I was listening to. Mid nineties, it was probably Sarah McLaughlin and Jewel and stuff like that. We both enjoyed the soundtrack to Pretty and Pink. We argue over who's a bigger fan Justin: As far as mine goes. Not exactly the same stuff that Jane was raised on, but probably in the same relative vein. I mean, my parents had, it was a lot of Beatles, blood, sweat and tears, seals and croft, that kind of thing. Fleetwood Mac. As I started getting into my own interest, particularly getting into the eighties as well, mine would've been, I guess a lot more alternative pop started off with stuff that would've shown up on radio, shown up in movies. And then I went much further afield and purposely started looking into stuff that nobody seemed to really know what it was, at least around our area. Laura: What would that be? Justin: So, I mean, I was a big one for doing, back in the day, I was the Walkman and then a CD player and people would go, well, what are you listening to today? And it's like, joy Division. They're like, I don't really know that. And I'm like, well, you might know New Order. And that was part of them. And then it would go further out and I would get into screaming cheetah wheelies or swimming pool cues. I started looking for stuff that the names weren't recognizable to see what was out there. And I kind of still do that. Laura: Streaming is great for that. Now you can find crazy Japanese, whatever. Justin: Yeah, exactly. Tsunami bomb and get into all kinds of, so be Sex Sue and things like that. Yeah. Laura: Today we're focused on alternative music, which is actually unusual for the podcast because it's set at a small market radio station that was playing adult contemporary. So what the character would've been playing on the radio is mostly Celine Dion and the lighter hits of Phil Collins. But what she liked was alternative music, and she was kind of a goth, although we didn't call 'em goths back then, but... Justin: Yeah, it's true. But we also didn't call them emo. I mean, what would've been the term then? I can't even think of what it would, I mean, maybe it would've been called... Laura: Yeah, I don't know. There was post punk New Wave after she gets her job and she interviews, she goes home and we see her in City Club in Detroit, which is a real club and dancing to the alternative music at this goth club. So this is the music that we've got today. How does that fit with your musical sensibilities? Justin: Ah, I mean, it's pretty interesting. I said to Jane, as we were reviewing on listening to some of these again, I realized, alright, well, in particular, Tones on Tail, for the life of me could not recall the name of that as a group. I had no idea. I was like, I don't think I know this one at all. And then when we looked at it and listened, I went, oh, wait a minute. Yes, I do know this one pretty well. And then I started digging a little deeper and said to, she was like, well, Daniel Ash, one of the main guys from that group was from Bauhaus, which I was familiar prior. And I was like, well, wait a minute. I think he was also loving rockets. So I had to look it up to make sure, but I was a big Love and Rockets fan. That would've had some heavy rotation for me probably into the nineties. Laura: So we'll get to Tones on Tail is the last one that we'll get to. But Daniel Ash, actually one of the characters in the book who's the traffic director, office manager, I gave her the name Leslie Ash. And that's actually a nod to Daniel Ash. It's in the book. Jane: Nice. Laura: A lot of these songs that were played in the clubs, you'd hear it in a dance club, at least that's where I experienced a lot of these songs was. When you're not hearing it on MTV or the radio and they're not announcing the name, you're just dancing along to it. You don't know who it is necessarily. And the first one Every Day is Halloween by Ministry, which is from 1984. This is one that I sort of threw in at the last minute, which is why I ended up with two tracks by Ministry playing in the club with Clara in the same chapter. It was something that was, I heard on a podcast or something, I was like, that is a song that we used to dance to all the time in City Club. And it's actually was the B side of a song called All Day, which I just discovered recently. And a lot of these alternative songs that they played in the clubs actually were B sides. The DJ would listen and the record label said, this alternative moody Track is going to be your A side. I didn't realize that. I knew all day until I listened to it. Just yesterday, I learned that it was the B side, and I thought, well, that's crazy. I got to hear the A side. And I said, “Oh, I've heard that too.” Justin: I ran into the same thing with Every Day as Halloween. I was like, the title didn't gel. I was like, no. And then listening, I was like, wait a minute. No, I do know this. And as we were looking for it, it was like, there's more Ministry than I remembered listening to. I forget, I wasn't a fan enough to get an album and things like that, but I mean, I certainly listened to it and would turn it up, but yeah, just didn't think. And I think Jane is similar to me where neither of us were going to clubs When we hit an age where that was a thing. No, I mean, yeah, for us, you would've had to go to Albany to go like the QE two. But yeah, I mean for me, this is kind of at a particular time period, a lot of this list definitely fits in with things I would've listened to. Laura: Clara, the character, she's a little bit darker and a little bit more heart edged in her music taste than I personally am or was. And so she comes in and her music taste is kind of the opposite of this light rock station. And so things like later Ministry and Nine Inch Nails, that's her new place. But let's talk about Ministry. Because Ministry, they made a really big change in their sound from the two tracks that we've got. What was your reaction to Everyday is Halloween, listening to it again? Justin: I was thinking about the fact that number one, I mean obviously it's a different pace to NWO and I almost would see that as more of something you would hear almost a little more commercially, although still its own thing, still in that goth direction, but a little less the term I used with Jane compared to say the NWO. Even if you want to throw in the Nine Inch Nails, a little less offness in the layering of all the Sounds, Laura: Ministry kind of started out as a synth pop in that Depeche Mode vein almost Duran Duran direction. Justin: I think a little, I mean for them, almost a little more cotton. Cotton candy comparatively lighter. Laura: Yeah. And that the record label was pushing them that way. And when I listened to the B or the A side of Every Day is Halloween, which is called All Day. Like I said, I didn't know that I remembered it. Neither of these songs, when I heard them did I associate with Ministry. But all Day Too is very synth pop, very new wave, almost mid eighties MTV kind of dance track. Yeah. Justin: But yeah, and as Ministry went along, it seemed like they got more and more on that harder edge industrial. Yeah, a little more electronica almost. He started going in a much different direction, much like Trent Reznor for Nine Inch Nails has gone. Laura: Yeah. Yeah. So this one, I mean, I kind of remembered as the bop bop bop song. Jane: That's about how I'd remember it. Justin: Well, as you had us check into this, I was listening and the backbeat to Every Day is Halloween. I'm like, it sounds like another song to me. And I was having a hard time pinning it down similar time period. And I started doing a little research and going, okay, well wait. Because obviously if you listen to even just those two songs, you can tell that Jorgensen is also getting big into sampling and using clips from things. So I was like, did they maybe do that for the drum machine? But it looks like it was similar equipment used by a lot of people at that time. So certain similar types of sounds were coming through. I was like, yeah, but there was something specific, and this is really terrible. But just before we got on Found, what was catching in my brain and what it was making me think of, which is oddly enough, the only thing that stands out from a very bad sequel Breaking Two Electric Boogaloo Oh no. Is one song because of the percussive sound to it, which is called Din Da Da. Laura: I know Din Da Da. that's George. No Trummeltanz... Justin: Yes, no you were there. George Kranz. Laura: George Kranz, Justin: Yes. Laura: Din da da. That's a fun track. Jane: Right. Justin: But I was going, there is a backbeat percussion that is almost exact, if not exact, in Everyday is Halloween. So when we're done, I'm going to need to actually listen to that again so I can... [Jane] Put it together. [Justin] That or peel the earworm out. Laura: I'm going to have to listen to him side by side now. No, I didn't remember that. Din Da Da was in Breaking Two, The Electric Boogaloo. Justin: I'm going, is it Breaking? Is it Beat Street? Because I watched, I mean, like I said, my music goes all over the place, but I watched all of those when I was younger, really loved Beat Street particularly, but Breaking Two obviously is not a good movie. But that song in the Sound stood out. And I particularly liked the, I mean, I'm a word person like yourself, and I particularly liked that basically it wasn't really lyrics, it was like gibberish sounds, but used in such a rhythmic way. It caught your ear and you couldn't not move with it. Right. Laura: Did you have the jacket, all the break stuff? Justin: No, I definitely was more in the rock, not quite goth direction. Laura: You weren't doing the moon walk? Jane: No. Justin: No. I don't even know that I ever tried that. I think I may have tried doing a worm once, and that was a complete fail and was like, it's not ever going to be a thing for me. Jane: We were actually in middle school together, and I still remember him from high school wearing a John Cusack long jacket, and I thought that was pretty darn cool. Laura: You did go and see Breakin' Two? Justin: I did. Yes. Jane: He made me watch it. Justin: Yeah. I think that was actually on the television more recently, and I'm like, it has been decades. I'm going to leave it. And it was like, wow. I mean, not that I want to get on a tangent about that, but I mean, it is amusing to think that the first movie did so well that they immediately pushed for a sequel and basically had no idea or a script on what to do. And they spent a huge chunk of budget doing one scene to make it look like Boogaloo Shrimp is dancing up the wall and on the ceiling by creating a slowly rotating set so that he could keep moving and they could film it. Laura: So they were ripping, ripping off Fred Astaire, Justin: Correct? Yes, yes. Jane: And it wasn't cheap. Justin: No, but oh yeah. I mean, as a movie, it's absolutely atrocious, but sometimes I will go back and check those and see if there's any redeeming qualities. And yes, again, the one song is good. Laura: As soon as I get off here, I'm going to listen to Every Day is Halloween and Dean Dadda and see if they sound the same. So do you think that Every Day is Halloween stands up? Is it something that you think that people would listen to today? Justin: Honestly, yeah. I mean, nowadays I feel like as I listen to more music and I hear other people talk about it, there are, yes, there is of course the usual radio type stuff. There is a lot of sub-genre stuff out there constantly being put out that's new and there is shoe gaze, there is various types of metal. I mean, in shoe gaze, I particularly, and that definitely hedges toward an emo goth direction. So there's some of it that it was like, oh, I could totally see somebody redoing even every day as Halloween now with one of those groups. Laura: I think the Boppy bop, bop aspect of it just makes it fun. Justin: No, it definitely does. Yeah. Which is interesting, as you brought up the other song being NWO, also very catching, but in a very different way. Laura: Well, why don't we talk about NWO? I actually went to see Ministry in concert. This is sort of NWO is like, it was a track that I could tolerate, but that industrial stuff was not my jam at all. It's not really mine, the screaming part of it. I mean, it kind of sounds like a track that you would use to torture prisoners by keeping 'em up all night, PSYOPs. It's that kind of a sound. So it's not my thing. So it's kind of surprising that I did go and I saw a Ministry in this period with helmet and a third band. I dunno, there was lots of people in black and leather and stage diving. I mean, it was a scene. Something to experience. But this one, in terms of industrial music, this was one because of, its kind of interesting sampling of George HW Bush. It kind of has this crazy anti-war visceral sound to it. It's got the percussion that sounds like machine guns, and it's got the soldier marching cadence. And so it seems like it says more than just screaming at you. Jane: It's true, Laura: Even though it's not really a sound that I want to revisit a lot. Justin: No, no, and I mean, I'm with you on that. Even when Ministry was a bigger group, it was not necessarily my type of sound. It feels more industrial in a way, but Nine Inch Nails went in a little more of that direction. Skinny Puppy was more in that direction. And again, I listened to Skinny Puppy, but not every day. I wasn't stuck on that genre. But mixing things in every once in a while, and it would sometimes just be for effect with somebody else. They'd be like, well, what are you listening to today? Oh, skinny Puppies, vivisection. And they're like, I don't know what the hell. Any of those words you just said, Laura: I want you to leave my house. That's why. Justin: Right. Well, yeah, and I think at times that was kind of what I was shooting for was just getting visceral reactions. Jane: I just avoided all that type of music basically until the late nineties when I was starting to feel that angst and anger that I kind of missed. In my teenage years, I did go to a local show, a friend was a drummer, and it was that screeching yelling. Every single lyric was screeching and I enjoyed it. I got it. The energy, the vibe, the expression of frustration or whatever you want to call it, it fit where I was at in life at the time, and I didn't necessarily go out and buy that particular stuff, but I definitely begged my friend for a copy of Voodoo and stuff like that. That was much louder and stained. Justin: The first was a Godsmack reference, right? Jane: Yes. Godsmack. And it really helped me through stuff. I played that stained album through some of my worst times back then, and it just allowed me to express that emotion and that feeling that was in my body out into my car with nobody else around. And it was very cathartic. Justin: And I remember, not that it's relevant to just the audio, but I showed Jane, I remembered the video that went along with that, which ties in with that sound. Equally, it's actual marching images. Occasionally there's a superpose of Bush with the New World Order clip. Jane: It's pretty powerful. Justin: Yeah, it's clearly got a message that it's trying to present. And I do remember that from when that was out. Laura: The Honolulu Star bulletin in its review said Ministries music addresses most directly the disillusioned generation that grew up in the shadow of thermonuclear Holocaust and is now confronted with the prospect of environmental suicide and the fraudulent piece of the American Proclaimed New World Order. So that was a contemporary review of the song. Jane: Well put. Yep. Laura: So what is your verdict on NWO New World Order? Jane: I think it's a bit heavy for my listening, to be honest, but I still enjoy listening to absolutely anything and give it a shot, not something I look out for, but the speed of the drums was pretty cool. Laura: Yeah. I think for me, the screaming vocals are kind of the killer for me in terms of enjoying it, but it's probably if I have a favorite industrial song, that is probably it. So moving on to Nine Inch Nails' Head like a hole, I actually, I did not like the song at all at the time when it was getting a lot of play. Jane: Yeah, agree. Justin: It did get played way too much. Jane: Yeah, Laura: It got played way too much and it had a video, I think that I would've seen it on 120 minutes on MTV and stuff like that. The video is not something I enjoy watching. And so between that and then again the screamy part of the song that put me off, but I found listening back to it, appreciating it a lot more, and it's almost, if you took out that sort of screamy part, it's really structured like a pop song. Justin: Yeah, no, absolutely. Laura: It's got, if you replaced it with a chorus with Beatles harmonies or something, it could be a pop song. Justin: I'm sure somebody out there has figured out some sort of mashup with another song to tie that in on TikTok, there's got to be something. Laura: There was one of those crooners, like maybe it was Tony Bennett or maybe it was like Pat Boone or something, did an album of heavy metal covers, which... Jane: Kind of fun. Laura: It's very self aware. Justin: Yeah. Jane: That was very cool. I like the crossovers like that. They're really interesting. Justin: There's a very weird Black Mirror episode with Miley Cyrus as a performer, and she's doing her cover versions of a couple of nine inch nail songs that give it a completely different feel. It's definitely got more of that sort of bubblegum quality to it. Laura: Yeah, it's fun with a bluegrass cover or something. Justin: Yep. Somebody should do that. That's true. I like that. Laura: Was this a song that you enjoyed in 1990 when it came out? Justin: I did. Yeah, I heard that one in particular and picked up the album and got into the entire album. There was something particular about the angst of the whole thing that worked really well and on really bad moments in life. It was easy to put that in and just let yourself be angry, push it through in a different way. Yeah, somehow it channeled. Well, I can see that. Yeah. Laura: I saw a deconstructed video where someone broke down all the different parts of this song and the different samples and layers, and it's got a sample in there of Samburu Warriors initiation, a field recording of Samburu people from Kenya, and that's in there, but it's almost like on a subliminal level, never heard it before. I saw the track kind of broken down. Jane: Yeah, I love that stuff. Justin: There are certain other groups that seem to have layered musical qualities within certain songs. Both of us got into a, what are they Welsh, a group called the Joy Formidable. Oh yeah. And there is a particular song that, I mean the description I gave, it was like a wall of sound coming at you, but it was not just a blast you in the face kind of thing. It was more like it built and built and built and there are all these different layers. The song in particular, I'm going to probably screw up the title, it's a long one. Love is the Everlasting Spectrum of Life, and it's quite a... It's one of those, if you listen to it and really start, I mean you got to listen to it more than once, but if you start letting your ear kind of break it down that way, you're getting, wait a minute, there's Bells tinkling in the background, and then there's obviously the guitar and you've got other percussions and you almost get some wave sounds that are coming through, but put all together, you're not picking up on all of that unless you can actually let your own filter gather it differently and start streaming it through. So it's really interesting. I find Head Like a Hole, same idea. You can't quite get that sample you're referring to, but eventually you get that there's something else and it kind of perceives, but it's so almost, for lack of a better term, with this song subtly woven in, it becomes part of it in a completely different way. Laura: This is another one where I learned something that I didn't know I had the lyrics wrong to this song until I was yesterday years old. I always thought it was got money, but it's God money. Justin: God money. Yeah. Laura: God money. Justin: Yeah. It's an interesting term. Laura: I mean, it makes the lyrics make more sense. That got money and then all of this sort of fight the man kind of like, I don't, you have money, so you don't need to fight the power. I don't know. Jane: Right. Laura: Actually, Trent Reznor enunciates really clearly for this kind of a angry song. You get every word even if you get one of them wrong. Justin: Right? No, no, no. It's true. Jane: Which is really hard with some of this stuff is I think that's where my disconnect comes in. If I can't at least get the gist of what they're talking about, then I get less interested. But if I can kind of feel, gather the words. Laura: In Ministry, New World Order besides the clips when he is doing this, I dunno what he said. Justin: Yeah, Laura: Right. Yeah. I didn't catch much of it either. Justin: No, it's true. But again, I mean sometimes I think that kind of thing is not meant for you to specifically get it in that way. You're just supposed to get the feel. Jane: Which I totally get because... Justin: And I can get behind that because I listen to other music from other countries and I don't know all the languages, but I don't need to either. Jane: Yeah. I love music in foreign languages because you listen to the feel of the song more. Both can be true, obviously, but yeah, I get right into Spanish or whatever French, I love getting just focusing on the sound instead of getting focused on the more logical ABCs of it. Laura: And then you've got your Dean Da das and your B Bs. Jane: Right. That helps. Laura: Or your yay yas as in Tones on Tail. How's that? Hey, see what there? Jane: That was really fun because I didn't think I'd heard it before. Justin: Yeah, same. Jane: And then we did a little research and we found out it's in one of our favorite movies, gross Point blank. And I was like, oh, that makes perfect sense Justin: Why I like it. It was the same problem. I'm going, I know. I know it from a movie. I felt like maybe it could have been eighties. And I'm like 16 candles. And then Jane's like, she looked it up and found Gross point blank and I went, alright. So my brain was getting there with John Ack. That's okay, we're almost there. Jane: Yeah, that was fun. Laura: Well, this is another one of those ones that I used to dance to in the alternative clubs. I had no idea who they were. It was just the Yaya song. And I liked in college, I liked Love and Rockets. I had no idea that there was a connection between this song and Love and Rockets and Bauhaus. Justin: I didn't know until today. Laura: Yeah, they're all Tones on Tail is kind of one combination of guys from Bauhaus and Love and Rockets is a different combination of guys from Bauhaus, but they have Daniel Ash in all of them. This is another one of those ones that was a B side. The A side was something called Lions, which I thought was kind of dirgey and Forgettable. Go was just for a decade they were still playing this in the alternative clubs. So get people out on the dance club. Justin: I dunno either of those. Laura: I mean, if you're like me, you might know All Da and just not know that you know it because... Justin: Yeah, exactly. It's possible. Laura: Tone on Tail is not one of your great group names, really. Justin: No, it's true. Laura: It comes from the reel tape. So it's the ketones on the end of the real tape. So that's the tone on tail. Justin: No kidding. All right. I don't know that that's going to make it gel any better, but I mean at least there's... Laura: I don't know, I guess it's maybe a better name than Frankie goes to Hollywood, but I'm not sure. Justin: Yeah, maybe if I have a band, it's just going to be named Placeholder and we're going to leave it at that. We're probably going to stick garage. Jane: I tend to get attracted to anything with more of a British background feel to it. Go was a lot easier for me to listen to than the other songs. Laura: I liked all of that, like Erasure and New Order and that stuff. Jane: Justin and I met probably first remember each other from violin lessons in fourth grade. So I gave up violin in fifth grade, but he kept going. So even though he's a movie buff, he has the musical background as well, which was kind of cool. Justin: Of course, I haven't touched the violin in longer than I played it. Laura: I remember being an elementary, the Suzuki method. Were you doing Twinkle Twinkle Little Star? I had a class that was in the room next to the Suzuki violin class in all class. You'd just be da da da da da da. Justin: At least there's that. My mother will still reference going. I remember she brings up another guy from school that would come over, or I'd go to his house and we'd practice together and she was like, it would sound like you two were killing geese in there. It was awful. Thanks. That's encouraging. It makes me want to stick with an instrument. I'm glad you didn't tell me at the time. Jane: I didn't have the patience for it. Justin: But I would come in and ripped up rock t-shirts and jeans. I had an earring. Jane: Yep. And a mullet. Justin: Yeah. Well, that was the hair trying to grow out at one point. It was not a purposeful mullet. Thank you. It Jane: Wasn't purpose. Okay. Sorry. Laura: We didn't call it a mullet then anyway. Justin: There would've been more, I had what would've been called then a rat tail. Jane: Oh, that's right. Okay. Yes. The rat tail. Yes, I remember them. Rat tail. Yeah. Justin: Yeah. That was up with that. Let's refer to it as something that's completely unappealing. It'll make them want to keep it. Jane: Oh, absolutely. Justin: Which, yeah, if you're the right kind of kid, absolutely. You're going to go, I care what you think. I'm going to grow it longer than it's true. Jane: I was too busy being on the outside and trying to fit in and please people. So I didn't do anything exciting like earrings. Justin: Yeah, I did. None of the people pleasing part at that point. You were, I wasn't trying to be purposefully push people away. It was just, look, you're either going to like me for who I am, and we can have a good conversation or you're not. I'm going to lose any kind of sleepover it if you're not. So I'm just going to be me. I'm trying to figure out who I am, and that's that. Laura: I mean, I love people who are doing their own thing. I remember I lived in Edinburgh for a while and downstairs of my apartment there was this busker and he was a punk bagpiper. And so he had this spiky Sex pistols hair. And then he had the traditional kilt and he was playing a mix of punk songs on bagpipe and Scotland The Brave. And it was just great. Nice. Perfect. That is. I Justin: Like it. Jane: Yeah. I mean, our first kind of saw date was going to see enter the haggis in North Hampton. Justin: Right. Jane: Okay. Laura: I didn't expect this to be a bagpipe themed episode. Justin: Well, yeah, it still won't be. Jane: But when I had been living on my own for quite a while, some friends invited me to go to a local Celtic festival and going there just made me feel right at home. So I glommed right onto that and my friends and I would go to various Celtic festivals through the years. So enter the Haggis was awesome. They just finished retired last year, which was sad. We went to that last show, Albanna Scottish Band, all just one pipe and the rest drums and some vocals. Fabulous. Get you right in the heart. And it's almost a church going type of experience, just really hits home, connects you to the past. They're very 700 Scotland kind of thing. So yeah, there were a bunch of Celtic bands that I just really, really feel that are a big part of my life and my sanity. Justin: Okay, but can you bring that back to the British Pop? Jane: The British pop? Yeah. I mean, whip it. Whip it real good. That was one of my favorite songs as a kid. Justin: Although they're not British. Jane: They're not. But I remember listening to it over there. So Justin: It's, Devo was here. DeVos an American Laura: Metal group. I'm trying to think of pop songs that had bagpipes on them and nothing is coming to mind. Big Country. Did they use … Justin: AC/DC, It's usually more rock, oddly enough. Jane: AC/DC. Justin: Right. But that's not really pop. Jane: No, it's not pop. Justin: I mean, Korn has gone in that direction too. But again, that's more metal rock than Jane: That first Celtic Festival. There was a band called K Claymore from Australia, and they did the most amazing version of Highway to Health. It was fantastic. Justin: So back to Tones on Tail. Jane: Tones on Tail Justin: Again. I'll try to pull you in. Go for it. There's a carrot over here, horse. Laura: Well, I can say something about Tones on Tail. It was basically Daniel Ash and et Al's attempt to kind of go a different way from Bauhaus. So Bauhaus, they're kind of constrained by having to be dark and moody and black. And so they would dress in all white and do the yaya's, and they wanted to show that they could have a good time too, too. Justin: Do you know any Bauhaus? Jane: I only know the name. No, not that I know that. I know. Justin: You would hear Bella Lugosi's Dead. Jane: That's a good one. Yeah, that is a good one. I really like that song. Justin: But that gives you a better idea what she's referring to. Tones on Tail. Like I said, I didn't recognize the name or even the title of the song and then hearing it, I was like, oh yeah, it does. It has almost that pop sensibility to the Upbeat and the Ya Ya. Laura: And I think that may be why they thought this was a B side, because it was so different from Bauhaus that they thought, okay, this is just us having a good time. And we'll put that on the B side and on the A side, we'll put something a little more... Justin: But it's interesting because then again, I mean they go on to Love and Rockets and Love and Rockets has a completely different sound from both of those two. Laura: And I think artists they wanted to play around. They don't want to do the same thing all the time. Justin: I mean, some groups are fine with that. But... Laura: Daniel Ash, in 2002, they asked of all of his bands what his favorite was and he said Tones on Tail. Justin: No kidding. Interesting. Yeah. I'm going to actually have to listen to some more of it now. Laura: It was just one of those when I found out they were all the same thing. And Daniel Ash has some solo stuff too, and I realized like, oh, I didn't know they were all the same thing. And I guess I like Daniel Ash. I like his stuff. Justin: Right. Laura: Okay. We have the four songs. So let's do the, what is it, American Bandstand, it's the wrap up, Justin: The countdown wrap up kind of thing. Laura: Yeah. So Halloween Every Day is Halloween. Thumbs up, thumbs down on Every Day is Halloween. Justin: Thumbs up Jane: Down Justin: For what it's... Really, for you? Justin: But for me, yeah, it's a thumbs up. Laura: It's a pro goth song. It's be nice to Your goths, don't be mean to your goths is the focus of the lyrics. Justin: Yeah, it's true. Laura: And then Ministry's later period, NWO. Thumbs up, thumbs down? Jane: Still down. Justin: I'm kind of doing the Emperor in the middle at this point. I mean, back then it would've been like, yeah, crank it up. Let me break some things. But now like I said, Laura: You just have to replace the things that you broke and... Justin: Yeah, I think expensive. Yeah, exactly. At a certain age it's like, I think I hurt myself breaking things, not as entertaining. You got to think about it and weigh out. Do I want to break that badly enough that I might get injured? There still might be a yes on occasion. On occasion, I can appreciate it for what it still is, but I probably, if I was forced to pick a direction, I'd probably be going down at this point. Laura: Okay. So we've got 50/50 on Halloween and a probably not on New World Order from Ministry. How about Head Like a Hole, Nine Inch Nails? Justin: I'm still up on that. I like all Nine Inch Nails and I like the progression throughout the career. Even with Trent at this point, he doesn't sing anymore as far as I can tell. I think he just does movie and TV background scores, but they're still atmospheric in their own way. But I mean, yeah, the angst of it, his lyrics still always resonate. If you've listened to other songs and the lyrics, they're always powerful. I mean, there's a strong poetry in there, so I can always give that a thumbs up. Jane: I'm doing the thumbs up, thumbs down. Would I listen to it again? Seek it out. No, thumbs down. Laura: Yeah, I am. I like it better than I did at the time, but not well enough that I want to put it on my playlist kind of thing. Justin: Yeah, I suppose I would go in that direction. I'm not necessarily looking to be playing the album after we get off of this, but... Laura: On the way to the grocery store in the car. Justin: Or after a bad day work or something. Yes. Jane: Have you noticed the grocery store music nowadays? It's great. It's eighties, right? Yeah. Laura: It's eighties. It's for the old folks like us. Justin: Well, but it's not elevator versions of things anymor. Laura: So that's good. Jane: No, right. There's an improvement in there. Absolutely. Laura: When I was working in radio in 92, we had the oldies category and oldies of course, then was early sixties. Justin: Yeah, Laura: Today it's like 1992, right? Justin: Yeah. Well, it's shocking. We have to kind of do that. Oh, right. That's like 30 years. Jane: It's just shocking. I don't feel any older. Justin: You look it though. Laura: It's okay. Back to the Future. He went back 30 years. Eighties. No, 20 years. It would be the two thousands. Justin: I think you're right, because it was Laura: Eighties, seventies, I think. Oh no, fifties. It was 30 years. Yeah. So almost it would be the late nineties he'd be going back to. Justin: Weird. And if you want to go to the second movie. Yeah. I mean, I think a bottle of Coke probably costs the same as it did in the future. Laura: So our final song of the day, Tones on Tail Go. Thumbs up. Justin: Yep. Yeah, I'm thumbs up. Laura: Good to end on a positive note. Justin: Definitely. So Laura: We're going to, I'll go out and check out the Daniel Ash catalog. Justin: Yeah, it's true. Laura: Well, thanks a lot for doing this. This was a lot of fun. Justin: Yeah, thanks for including us. Jane: Yeah. Laura: Thanks for listening. The music discussion continues next week with our guest, Sophia Lee, who'll be here to talk about the music posters that Clara Jane puts up on her walls in the town of Saturn. We'll talk about the weird and wonderful sugar cubes. The difference between dance clubs in Fascination Street and in Prial Scream's Loaded and melodic songs about car crashes with the Stone Roses Sophia (future guest): It also seems like it might've been a multi-car pile on, because there's the one lyric about how the 10 twisted grills grin back at me and it's like 10. There's 10 cars. Laura: So he wrote a song about it, like you do. See you then.